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money. and the average person needs that $2,000 in his pocket to drive the economy. saying that tax breaks for the rich drive consumers lower down to spend is like saying you could start your car by pouring gasoline on the hood. there's no proof, there's no factual data to support it. it's completely a sham to say that. >> and he's a business owner. we need more members of congress to sound like that. if the president is trying to achieve solidarity on raising the top tax rate, these are the voices that can come through for them with that message in a big way. an owner of an automobile supply company says she supports the plan even if it means her own personal rates will go up. . >> i would have higher tax rates, but r more important and more crucial, the middle class would be spending about $3,000 more. >> harry reid kept the focus on the president's winning campaign message of letting the tax cuts expire on incomes over $250,000 a year. >> the people who have done so well during this difficult time with the economy, the richest of the rich are going to have to pay a little more to
? and what are the consequences for the economy if there isn't one? we'll ask the president's lead budget negotiator, treasury secretary tim geithner. >>> then the view from capitol hill. are democrats as divided over cutting medicare as republicans are over tax increases? with us, two voices calling for compromise. republican senator bob corker of tennessee and democratic senator claire mccaskill of missouri. >>> finally, our special economic roundtable. as both sides battle over the nation's fiscal health, what can we expect from the economy in a second obama term? what is the vision for an economic rebound? >>> from nbc news in washington, the world's longest-running television program, this is "meet the press" with david gregory. >>> and good sunday morning. amidst a lot of partisan rhetoric on both sides, talks on the fiscal cliff are now at a stand still, and the president is back on the campaign trail of sorts. this time to try to win in a court of public opinion for his plan to avert an automatic tax hike for everyone on january 1. that's where we'll start this morning with the po
the economy has to be good and she has to decide that it the national mood is going to be such in 2016 that the country is going to want to stick with a democrat. >> michael tomasky, good to have you with us. that "the ed show." and tomorrow night nancy pelosi will join me to talk about the fiscal cliff. "the rachel maddow show" starts right now. >> good evening, ed. thank you. thanks to you at home for staying with us. if you get a tweet from president obama, you will know it by his signature. the president has an official twitter account from which all sorts of on message things get tweeted. but the white house says you know when a tweet has been written by the president himself because in that case the tweet gets a little initial signature. a "bo" in lower case. barack obama, as in i the president wrote this tweet. if it was a dog, it would be the paw print. the president was writing his own tweet this is afternoon. the string of twitter messages about the budget negotiations in washington. the white house announcing in advance today that the president himself wou
families should go up. it would be bad for the economy. it would be bad for those families. in fact, it would be bad for the world economy. and so i think it's very important that we get that resolved. and i am very open to a fair and balanced approach. >> the president met with middle class tax payers today, urging them to employ twitter hash tag my y2k, telling congress this is too important for them to screw it up. >> today i'm asking congress to listen to the people who sent us here to serve. i'm asking americans all across the country to make your voice heard. it's too important for washington to screw this up. >> and a new survey shows the president has the public on board in a new washington post poll, 60% support raising taxes on incomes over $250,000. a healthy majority. indeed, even some republicans appear to be under sway, by the force of reason. >> in my view, we all agree we're not going to raise taxes on people that make less than $250,000. we should just take them out of this discussion right now. continue to fight against any rate increases. try to continue to work h
-breaking corporate profits show the economy is well on the road to recovery. what does it mean for workers? i'll give you some numbers and sam stein will be along with the conversation. >>> and world leaders say farewell to hillary clinton with a ringing endorsement. you'll want to see this video. michael tomasky on whether hillary clinton will make a run for the white house. share your thoughts on facebook and on twitter. we're coming right back. >>> welcome back to "the ed show." thanks for watching tonight. republicans are doing a lot of maneuvering on the fiscal cliff. president obama and the democrats have put forward a plan relying mostly on raising more revenue from the wealthiest 2% of the country. republicans rely mostly on cuts affecting the middle class and the poor and republicans aren't specific about how they get $800 billion in revenue. for the conversation, let's turn to richard wolffe, msnbc political analyst and vice president and executive director of msnbc.com. and molly ball, political reporter for "the atlantic." the republican proposal includes ryan's voucher program for medica
's time i explain to these good people about the fiscal cliff. think of the economy as the car and the rich man as the driver. if you don't give the driver all the money, he'll drive you over a cliff. it's just commonsense. >> finally someone on the right willing to tell the truth. but here's the thing. this time it doesn't matter if mr. burns, speaker boehner, or the tea party try to hold the american people hostage just to get what they want. the president isn't going to budge. >> so i want to sq thank you both for coming on the show tonight. congresswoman, let me start with you. is the gop serious about holding the economy hostage again just to get what they want? >> well, think about the cards that they are holding. they are in favor of tax cuts for the rich. they want to cut tax care programs and medicare and make seniors pay and threaten the economy of the united states of america by defaulting on payments or at least to threaten that. this is not a very popular position among the public. in fact, they will be -- i think it's a suicide mission that they are on, that the a
to work on what we all agree to, which is let's keep middle-class taxes low. that's what our economy needs. that's what the american people deserve. >> white house also turning to social media has a twitter hash tag to spread its message. >> today i'm asking congress to listen to the people who sent us here to serve. i'm asking americans all across the country to make your voice heard. tell members of congress what a $2,000 tax hike would mean to you. call your members of congress. write them an e-mail, post it on their facebook walls. you can tweet it using the hash tag #my2k. not y2k, my2k. >> i think that's going to push us into the promised land. >> i was incredibly encouraged. i had been depressed and then i said this could actually get done with a hash tag. >> you're very pessimistic. we heard erskine bowles saying yesterday, he thinks it's less than a one in three chance, of course, co-author of the simpson-bowles plan. >> i was in washington earlier this week and met with a lot of these characters. the bottom line is there have been a lot of meetings, most of them between people w
on us all. now through january 2nd. >>> record-breaking corporate profits show the economy is well on the road to recovery. what does it mean for workers? i'll give you some numbers and sam stein will be along with the conversation. >>> and world leaders say farewell to hillary clinton with a ringing endorsement. you'll want to see this video. michael tomasky on whether hillary clinton will make a run for the white house in 2016. share your thoughts on facebook and on twitter. we're coming right back. from easy, breezy, beautiful covergirl. i have obligations. cute tobligations, but obligations.g. i need to rethink the core of my portfolio. what i really need is sleep. introducing the ishares core, building blocks for the heart of your portfolio. find out why 9 out of 10 large professional investors choose ishares for their etfs. ishares by blackrock. call 1-800-ishares for a prospectus which includes investment objectives, risks, charges and expenses. read and consider it carefully before investing. risk includes possible loss of principal. >>> welcome back to "the ed show." thank
and it actually doesn't make sense for the economy overall because middle income families drive the economy more than 80% of the economic activity of consumer spending is generated from people making less than 150, not 250. so we need to have middle income families have that security and then we can talk about the top 2%. >> the president is sitting down, as we speak, with six governors from both sides of the aisle. >> right. >> we're getting first pictures in of that meeting. as we wait to hear what comes from this, is it time for the president to make speaker boehner an offer that he just can't refuse, one that both sides are going to look at as serious? what harry reid is saying a what the gop came back is a nonstarter. john boehner said over the weekend we are nowhere on this. it's a nonstarter plan and i'll raise you with a nonstarter plan? >> i do think that at this stage sometimes the coverage of the back and forth doesn't really indicate to americans what's really happening. there's going to be a the lo of back and forth. i think it's still relatively early because you have two proposals
of the economy is for everyone to pay more in taxes and guarantee a form of public goods. the most successful democracy is where it is structured around universe albens where everyone pays in and makes use of what the state provides. now, no leaders are making that argument. in the short run, they are right not to. getting rid of the entirety of the bush tax cuts for all brackets hurts the recovery. once we are in the recovery, we have to do at least that and more. the question is, does the death of the consensus mean american voters are ready to hear that? how will this president or the next make the case? joining me today, governor of connecticut, a senior research fellow at george mason university. senior economic director at naacp and a fellow at the roosevelt institute. it's great to have you all here. i like when i do these spiels, listen to withering criticism from the panel. what do you think of the thesis, at least about the politics of the undoing of the consensus? >> i think this focus on grover is just it's wrong. i mean grover is just one guy advocating for a position that i thin
this wrong, the economy is going to go south. we don't have a lot of time here. we have a few weeks to get this thing done. we could get it done tomorrow. optimistically, i don't think we are going to get it done tomorrow. >> the white house is using all social media resources to get the message out and put pressure on the republicans. >> today, i'm asking congress to listen to the people who sent us here to serve. i'm asking americans all across the country to make your voice heard. tell members of congress what a $2,000 tax hike would mean to you. call your members of congress, write them an e-mail, post it on their facebook walls. you can tweet it using the hash tag my 2 k, not y2 k. >> the president was laughing about you the strategy, seriously effective. the my2k was one of the top trends on twitter all day long. republicans aren't too happy. they are getting outflanked. >> if the president wants to reach an agreement, he needs to be talking with the members of his own party right here in washington trying to broker an agreement, not out there firing up crowds and giving speeches. >>
the economy. >> i've heard of the economy, yes. >> the unemployment rate is still way too elevated. 7.9%. gdp got a pop but most of us agree it is growing well too slowly. this is our biggest near term problem. our biggest near term problem is not the budget deficit. that is a long-term problem, a serious problems, we have a chance to do something about it. . if we can at the same time, help the 2013 economy by giving it a bit of a boost, that means a lot to workers, their paychecks, job availability. i'm very happy to see that was in there. >> when you look at the white house's proposal, what do you think they think they can actually get? >> i think they think they can get the increase in the top rates. that's the biggest kind of thing to finally break the mold on that, to really push back against the kind of grover norquistian asymmetry. i think they can get that. i'm not sure we end up at 396 for the top rate, but i think they will get that. i think probably by giving some on the entitlements as is in their opening bid, they will be able to get back to perhaps some of the stimulus ideas as
that will affect your spending, lifestyles or the economy in any significant way. >> yes, indeed. the president is standing confident standing firm on middle class tax cuts and against any effort by republicans to throw the debt ceiling into the equation. >> if congress in any way suggests that they're going to tieç negotiations to debt ceilg votes and take us to the brink of default once again, as part of a budget negotiation, i will not play that game. >> as the president perfects his steely gaze, keep in mistake he's keeping side eye on splintering cracks appearing amongst congressional republicans' supposedly solid front. >> personally u i know we are to raise revenue. i don't care which way we do it. i would rather see the rates go up than do it the other way. >> let's take the american people out of the line of fire. particularly that 98%. >> maybe there's something in the oklahoma water supply. if republican lawmakers are falling pray to the mendacious middle class those at fox news are standing up for the needs of those persecuted top earners. >> this is a different america. how did w
, than in january with the world economy in turmoil and second recession coming. number two, john boehner, the speaker is claiming he's met obama's demand for higher taxes for the rich. that's good. he agreed in principle the rich must pay more. number three, there's talk for the republican leaders that they could vote to continue the tax cuts for the 98% now and therefore avoid the fiscal cliff and put off for now the top 2%. and the question then, let the debt ceiling not take effect. a tax cut delayed i argue is a tax cut avoided. joining me with the republican defense highly tauted fan of the eagles, ed rendell and alex wagner of msnbc's "now." governor, i want you to read what's going on here. first speaker boehner defended the gop's tax proposal saying it does take a bite out of the rich but president obama held firm to tax rate hike on the wealthiest. let's listen to the back and forth. >> revenues we're putting on the table are going to come from, guess who? the rich. there are ways to limit deductions, close loopholes and have the sameç people pay moref their money to the feder
obama during his victory speech said he wanted to hit down, talk to romney about the economy, his views on the economy specifically right how giving the looming fiscal cliff. so i suggest -- or i imagine they will discuss that, as well. but do we expect anything larger to come out of this? the white house is managing expectations saying there is really no agenda for this luncheon. it's really to bury the hatchet and to allow the country to move on, as well. >> right now, though, we do know treasury secretary tim geithner as we were telling everyone was on the hill, these marathon meetings with congressional leaders. what more do we know about those meetings? obviously starting off with some of the harder ones at first bhak through nancy pelosi as his last. >> we know the treasury secretary will be heading to the hill with rob nabors. he will be meeting with all of these congressional leaders separately. starting off -- or including house speaker john boehner. of course boehner will be key to moving the needle on these fiscal cliff negotiations. this comes on the heels of a phone call be
to then quickly craft a legislative deal that can stop the damage to the economy that would occur if we went off the cliff and stayed off the cliff. john boehner recognizes that the fiscal cliff is the president's leverage, but boehner believes he has leverage, too. politico reported this morning president barack obama made a demand of how john boehner near the end of their first white house meeting on the fiscal cliff, raised the debt limit before year's end. boehner responded, quote, there is a price for everything. boehner told president obama at the white house that the debt limit increase is quote my leverage. although he added that he's flexible on when it should be done. senator durbin said today that raising the debt ceiling must be part of any deal with republicans. >> i also think that the president isn't going to sign off on any agreement that doesn't include some certainty as to budgets, appropriations, dealing with our debt ceiling. we're not going to find ourselves with some big party celebrating in february and then turn around and march and have another doomsday scenario with the
on to conservative principles very closely. for example, the need for what they call a pro-growth economy, like senator ron johnson. let me play for you what he had to say. >> this president simply doesn't understand that and as a result he's going to punish success, put at risk the economic growth that we really need to create jobs, revenue that we need. >> this is sort of the talking point that we've been hearing all along. is there any indication around capitol hill that there is some softening on that? >> i don't even know what that means, putting -- basically, i believe that the argument is that only by decreasing taxes can you lead to growth. there is a lot of historical evidence that that is not necessarily the case. i think the issue for the gchop right now is whether the tax cuts expire for everyone or whether for only those with income over $250,000. >> let me bring in jim from the national journal. jim, we had a little technical problem there. let me ask you about what she said said. can anything be decided at all until a decision is made about who is going to have tax cuts expire if
economy, it would be good for our children's future. and i believe that both parties can agree on a framework that does that in the coming weeks. in fact, my hope is to get this done before christmas. but -- the place where we already have in theory at least complete agreement, right now, is on middle-class taxes. and as i've said before, we have two choices. if congress does nothing, every family in america will see their taxes automatically go up at the beginning of next year. starting january 1st, every family in america will see their taxes go up. a typical middle-class family of four, would see its income taxes go up by $2200. that's $2200 out of people's pockets. that means less money for buying groceries, less money for filling prescriptions, less money for buying diapers. it means a tougher choice between paying the rent and paying tuition and middle-class families just can't afford that right now. by the way, businesses can't afford it either. yesterday, i sat down with some small business owners who stressed this point. economists predict that if taxes go up on the mi
and that would be good for businesses, for our economy, for future generations. and i believe both parties can and will work together in the coming weeks to get that done. we know how that gets done. we're going to have to raise a little more revenue, we've got to cut out spending we don't need, building on the trillion dollars of spending cuts we've already made, and if we combine those two things, we can create a path where america's paying its bills while still being able to make investments in the things we need to grow like education and infrastructure. we know how to do that. but, you know, in washington, nothing is easy so there's going to be some prolonged negotiations. and all of us will have to get out of our comfort zones to make that happen. i'm willing to do that. i'm hoping enough members of congress in both parties are willing to do that as well. we can solve these problems. but where the clock is really ticking right now, is on middle-class taxes. at the end of the year, middle class taxes that are currently in place are set to expire. middle class tax cuts that are currently i
over $250,000 paying a higher tax. they have confidence in this economy, perhaps the reason that your party saw success in the election. what do you make of this notion that, again, some republicans say the president doesn't get small business or economic growth somehow? >> well, i think the american people roundly rejected that. they think the president gets it. that's why they voted for the president. more than that, economists think the president gets it. this really is a balanced approach, and i don't think any credible economist will tell you we can simply cut our way out of the current deficits and debt. we need new revenues, and where should they come from? should they come from a middle class or working families that have really struggled or had setbacks in the last decade, or should it come from families that have done very well and can be asked to do more? if you look at the prosperity we enjoyed during the clinton administration when the tax rates were higher on upper income families, that certainly didn't kill economic growth. we have incredible economic growth during the
's what our economy needs. that's what the american people deserve. >> the white house is also turning to social media in a new twitter hash tag to spread his message. >> today, i'm asking congress to listen to the people who sent us here to serve. i'm asking americans all across the country to make your voice heard. tell members of congress what a $2,000 tax hike would mean you to. call your members of congress. write them an e-mail, post it on their facebook walls. you can tweet it using th the #my2k. not y2k, #my2k. >> they showed support for cutting a deal with the president. yesterday the oklahoma republican repeated his belief that congress should start by locking in tax cuts for the middle class. >> in my view, we all agree that we're not going to raise taxes on people that make less than $250,000. we should just take them out of this discussion right now, continue to fight against any rate increases, continue to try to work honestly for a much bigger deal. >> if the president is willing to accept 80% of the bush tax cuts for 98% of the american people, i think that's a point we
revenue. >> the economy is in a different position, the president actually did sign into law a series of cuts, he's proposed a lot in his 2013 budget. it's not like he's been stagnant. we've been having this argument throughout the presidential campaign and guess what? as we keep saying, americans said we're not buying it. the conditions have changed, the economy has changed, i think the outlook in the picture has changed. that's part of the reason the president is so firm about not going back to the debt ceiling conversation again and creating that level of instability and not bending on this issue of raisings the rates on the top 2%. >> yeah. i think -- >> go ahead. >> it's an important point. i think the american people are seeing that the president has already agreed to more than a year ago to that $1 trillion of cuts. that was 100% in cuts as part of the budget control act and he's always said we need a balanced approach. we can't do it through cuts alone. he has proposed additional cuts as part of the process but you need to have that revenue component to have the balanced appro
. >> professor robert reich and dr. james peterson, wisdom galore. >>> next, the economy shows real signs of life. will a cliff dive send it spiraling downward? stay with us. >> thousand or millions. >> millions. >> okay. >> no, i'm sorry, greta, thousands. >> oh -- >> no. between $27 million and $40 million. >> okay. >> a year. ♪ aids is not going to take my baby. ♪ aids will not take our future. ♪ our weapons are testing... education, care and support. ♪ and aids... ♪ aids is going to lose. aids is going to lose. ♪ ♪ ♪ [ male announcer ] while you're getting ready for the holidays, we're getting ready for you. tis the season. for food, for family, and now, something extra -- for you. >>> the most severely conservative of republican pundits have consulted their unskewed polling and they see an electorate that will reward any republican who refuses to compromise on the fiscal cliff. now, we know that attitude didn't work well with voters when republicans held the debt ceiling hostage last year, but now with the economy showing signs of life this week, the question becomes will the
, there is progress in some key sectors of our economy. we've seen housing finally begin to bounce back for the first time and that has an enormous ripple effect throughout the economy. consumer confidence is as high as it's been. many of you over the last two or three years have experienced record profits or near record profits and have a lot of money in plants and equipment and hire folks. obviously globally, the economy is still soft. europe is going to be in the doldrums for quite some time, asia is not charging forward and some of the emerging markets are not charging forward as quickly as they were maybe a few years ago, but i think all of you recognized and many of you told me is that everybody's looking to america, because they understand if we're able to put forward a long-term agenda for growth and prosperity that's broad-based here in the united states, that confidence will not just increase here in the united states, it will increase globally and we can get the virtuous cycle that i think all of us have been waiting for and want to see. what's holding us back right now ironically is a lot
a downturn in the economy in january, then the republicans are going to say, see, we told you, even though they created the problem. >> david cay johnson, great to have you with us. that's "the ed show." "the rachel maddow show" starts right now. good evening, rachel. >> good evening, ed. thanks, man. thank you for staying with us for this hour. the acting director of the cia met for more than an hour with senators john mccain and lindsey graham along with the u.n. ambassador susan rice. the three senators emerged from the meeting saying they were honored by the fact that the cia director would meet with them, just three random senators and not in some official capacity testifying before committee on the hill. they appreciated the fact that the administration and the intelligence community was going to such lengths to e swaj their concerns to personally answer their questions about the libya attack in a closed-door meeting with the cia director himself, even though these are just three random senators. the senators said their questions were answered as reasonably could be expected a
economy, the price of gas has an impact on how much pocket change americans have to save or spend on anything else. >> people are not happy this morning. gas prices are going up. many people are flocking to places like this to find the cheapest gas prices around. right now a gallon is going to cost you $4.13. last week it jumped 16 cents. prices are expected to go up another 20 cents in the next few days. >> gas prices go up and down. there's supply and demand. every once in awhile like in that report, there's a dramatic spike. the weird thing about that particular gat spike in may that sparked that report was that that spike was really isolated. gas prices went way up in california, even as gas prices everywhere else were going down. and at the same time that gas prices were going up in california, crude oil prices [ male announcer ] we all make bad decisions. like say, gas station sushi. cheap is good. and sushi, good. but cheap sushi, not so good. it's like that super-low rate on not enough car insurance. pretty sketchy. ♪ and then there are the good decisions. like esurance.
the economy if you raise tax rates on the top two rates. it will hurt small businesses, hurt our economy. >> so let's bring in the political panel on this topic for today. erin mcpike back with us and david goodfriend, democratic strategist and contributor. thank you for sticking around. let's bring in the element of tom cole, a republican of oklahoma. doesn't get more red than oklahoma. let's play what he said regarding support and passing the middle class tax cut. >> in my view, we all agree we won't raise taxes on people making less than $250,000. we should take them out of this discussion right now. >> what is the issue with that? >> well, what congressman cole has really shown is that there's an imminent amount of good logic and sense in preserving the current tax rates for 98% of americans for a lot of reasons. one of which is the gdp dependent on consumer spending. 0% of the economy is consumer spending. if you take $2,000 on average out of pockets of consumers, it's going to hurt the economy so right away you have a low tax good economic rational behind it but there are politics
within the argument for the debt ceiling with s that we should enter the american economy into a becau majo v that i argument. it is long past time to get rid of the debt ceiling and the modified mcconnell/obama plan is as good a way as any to do it. it gives lawmakers a way it avoid a fiscal cliff or fiscal curve. it can end flirtations with fiscal suicide. that the last word. i'm ezra klein in for ed o'donnell. >>> the president has returned from his trip. chris matthews and "hardball" is next. >>> a no-brainer for boehner. let's play "hardball." ♪ good evening. i'm chris matthews in washington. let me the start tonight with this. somebody has got to break it to mr. boehner, your side lost. romney, remember him? he's the guy who ran on the rich man's platform. the hands off the big boys' ticket. he's the guy who said his fellow 2%ers have your back. mr. boehner, ye of limited memory, the voters looked this issue directly in the eye, they heard your guy, romney, playing palace guard for the plutocrats, and they said i think i'll vote for the guy who is looking out for the middle cla
impact on the entire economy. obviously, toys and other things, as well. >> the president's plan calls for raising the tax rates on americans earning $250,000 or more. most republicans remain dead set against the president's plan. >> that's true. i think, though, we have to take a look at the larger context. the larger context is we have a math problem. we have $2.5 trillion that we're taking in every year on the federal government and $3.5 trillion that we're spending. so, we're going to need a balanced approach of both revenue and spending cuts to teat there. so, that's what the president has been talking about and certainly something i can support. >> "the wall street journal" today senior administration officials say the white house not making any new offers until republicans change their opposition to raising top tax rates in this country. as a businessman, that would be directly affected by an impasse like that, as would millions of americans. how do you feel about that? >> how i feel, i'm 100% confident we'll resolve the fiscal cliff pretty much a day or two before christmas. wh
through in the next two years. that's a much bigger risk to the economy. >> therefore? >> therefore, if the president lets this thing -- look, the markets have already priced this in. >> i hear the opposite. i hear that they believe that grown-ups will do the job when they have to. they don't believe they're going to let us go over theically. >> i don't think the grown-ups believe they have to do the job by january 1st. i believe they believe the grown-ups have to do the job by january 30th or february 15th. >> they're going to believe the politicians can get the job done when they failed to get it done by january 1st. >> i hear what steve is saying there. i'm standing in your camp which is a rare spot for me to be in, standing in chris' camp here but i think you're right. i think the markets have not baked this into their equation. >> dysfunction and childishness. >> it has nothing to do would my bottom line in terms of how i'm going to pay for things. as a market force, i don't think they've baked that in. number two, i don't think that the president is going to allow this thing t
really wants to avoid sending the economy over the fiscal cliff, he has done nothing to demonstrate it. the position of congressman tom cole, that the party should agree immediately to extend the bush tax rates for americans making less than $250,000 a year is the best of a bunch of bad choices for the gop. >> the g 0 op is boxed in saying it's a terrible position because by default democrats get what they want. a big bargaining chip for house republicans is they need congress to raise the debt ceiling before the end of february when analysts estimate the treasury would run out of options and hit the borrowing cap. no deal is reached. closer to the deadline and today they will argue that's bad for business. help in supporting an approach without drama or delay a. >> we can't be going through another debt crisis, debt ceiling crisis like in 2011. that has to be dealt with. >> the president of the business roundtable has said congress should raise the debt ceiling enough for the next five years to avoid uncertainty. clearly that's something that won't happen. short term spending cuts sho
. again, the economy is doing a little better. the unemployment numbers have been a little better, but what's the impact? >> 2 million people -- >> 2 million would lose. >> -- would lose income. here's the thing. there's a lot of talk of these people are looking or not looking for jobs, they're just taking this check. that's not the case. there's only one job for every three folks looking for a job. so there literally is not a job available for two of those people. so they have this income, unemployment insurance which keeps them in the economy, a functioning part of the economy, so they can spend the money. so the economic policy institute went ahead and extrapolated. if you were to keep this $30 billion cost of extended unemployment insurance, actually, that will pump another $15 billion to $18 billion into the economy because these folks are spending money. and that's what fuels our economy. >> some of the people who argue that we should go off the fiscal cliff, that it will push them to negotiate a sort of more thoughtful deal -- >> right. >> -- they say that it's not a fiscal
of this country's economy. and actually, things are looking up, if you look at -- >> they're not saying that. >> -- the data. >> they're not saying that. i'm saying small business owners will be hurt. >> yeah. >> if you raise taxes. but -- we're talking about compromise. this is my view. you've got your view. you know what the answer is? >> yeah. >> getting together and talking saying, listen, this is what i can live with. you know what? 39.6% is offensive, even raising it 1 percentage point is offensive. why don't we do what warren buffett says and anybody that makes $1 million or more pays 30%, a minimum tax rate of 30%. and you raise the level up to $500,000 instead of $250,000 and i'll go ahead and reluctantly agree to raise the top rate to 37%. that's how deals are done, but you never get there if you don't have a president and congress -- >> but they can't do that now. >> why can't they do that? >> it's the centerpiece of their argument since the campaign and tim geithner on the sunday shows. they say there is no deal about raising taxes on the wealthy. >> and they're right. the matter
disaster not only for our country, but the worldwide economy. >> so defaulting on the credit is unacceptable to you? >> i don't think -- i don't think it's a question that's even on the table. >> failing to raise the debt ceiling is not even on the table. that's what john boehner said last january. and yet just a few months later, with that voting record and with that stated understanding of how bad it would be for this country to not raise the debt ceiling, there was john boehner, leader of the congressional republicans, threatening to not raise the debt ceiling. e threatening default after decades of voting to raise the debt ceiling, no questions asked under president bush, under president obama the republicans decided they were not going to do it anymore. right around this time last year, republicans threatened to let the country go into default unless president obama met their demands. they explicitly recognized it would cause harm, but they were happy to do that. they were willing to incur that it harm. to inflict that harm on the country in order to get other stuff that
with him. the goal here is to grow the economy and control spending. you're not going to grow the economy if you raise tax rates on the top two rates. we're willing to put revenue on the table as long as we're not raising rates. >> so, joy, boehner is not exactly ready to go along with the american people, it seems. >> i think what you just saw there, rev, was a man waiting for bated breath on january 3rd, hoping that every day gets shorter and shorter and shorter as long as we're still in the lame duck congress and tea party members are still there. i think john boehner still has an ounce of fear that he will lose that vote. so he's always watching his right flank. i think boehner will be in a stronger position if we get to january 3rd and there isn't a deal and he can force a deal on his tea party members but this is a guy who still has to message to the right. this deal would have to be made by the congress that just lost the election, the congress headed by the tea party. and it's iron ironic that it lost the election but boehner has to cling to it for now. >> but the american people
, diverse -- >> -- black, members of congress -- >> -- women. >> yes. that's ironically what our economy will look like in worker bees and retirement bees. >> now and -- >> you're playing defense here tonight. don't join us as a commentary. what's the story about your party. i see it -- i get increasingly aware, as you watch this show develop over the last 18 years in different forms, i get increasingly aware there's all white people at the table. a sunday show, for example, you get a sense, there's something wrong with this picture. do republicans have that sensitivity? >> she mentioned rogers, the number four people -- >> what do they do? >> they hold conferences every week. they run the retreats. >> run the retreats? >> john boehner -- >> you're getting in deeper and deeper. >> they run the caucus meetings every week. she runs the caucus, decides which speakers come in. vice chair of the caucus, lynn jenkins, virginia fox -- >> what's a more important position, chairman and vice chairman of the caucus or speaker of the house -- >> or committee chair. >> any of the committees. >> caucu
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